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Post by foulballz on Sept 23, 2015 11:23:45 GMT -5
My ideal tourney would be much simpler. McHale only instituted all these rules to protect the world and player pool for future installments. I don't think anybody wants to go through this same madness again though. I'd eliminate all rules except one. I'd want everyone to sign every single one of their draft picks that would sign for slot, and not allow any transferring out of prospect budget until after the regular season concludes. I figure even if everyone budgeted 0 for draft scouting, somebody's going to draft and wind up with the good players eventually. I'd assume all worthwhile IFA's would get signed, especially now that initial demands are so low. If not, after regular season concludes, and this would be strictly voluntary, we could transfer money to whoever sees a good one and can't afford it. Any player aquired in this manner would remain in the minor leagues for duration of the tourney. If player was used in the bigs, death penalty. That's it. No other rules. Most owners are going to make sure their legit prospects develop anyways, and if not, it's still the same player pool for all in the future anyhow.
As far as undesirable contracts that would get inherited. We would do the two round draft. Either pick your big draft position, or your team. So if you do get stuck with a bad contract, that means you got a top pick and can get a young cheap talent to balance it out. I'm guessing that somebody will eventually choose first pick in big draft in first round of the two round big draft position/team draft. If so, they can't complain about bad contract they got stuck with.
-----------IF everyone chooses a team in first round, we could then have every team transfer money to whoever doesn't want a player/contract to even it all out. They would then delegate said player to the minors for duration of tourney. Using a player in the bigs that you received money for would result in the death penalty.
Buy-In --- The buy-in HAS to include extra $25 which goes to whoever is running the team after the 4th season concludes. $25 towards prize pool with similar payout structure as this one and $25 towards last man standing, so $50 total. Having half the teams get their money back keeps a lot more people in the tourney. And with no games subtracted penalties, will keep everyone in the running too.
This plan doesn't help as much to maintain the world for future tourneys, but if we can't have all rainbows and unicorns next time, there is no future. Heck, maybe by then, if ADMIN sees what a peaceful and happy group we've become, they'll decide to just build us a new world everytime.
As far as getting drafted players on your team, everyone would be responsible for your own. Send your own 8K minor leaguer for players you drafted. That way you know who has or hasn't been included in a trade already. No use of waiver wire for your own team for the first 3 days of the tourney to allow for necessary transfers that way. Any player with no-trade clause will be waived, no more double trading. Pay attention to your expected budget while drafting. We may have to come up with a way to penalize for drafting more salary than budget allows.
On a final note, of the 8 original owners who left, 3 are no longer on WIS. And 2 just quit last year, both citing despising this game because of the endless drama. I think we do have a lot of good quality owners in here. There's a bunch of people at the bottom of the rankings with no hope of placing honoring their commitment. While I don't think people need to be praised for honoring their word, I just want to point out that welching was the abberration, and not the norm.
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Post by foulballz on Sept 23, 2015 11:27:09 GMT -5
Oh, and during the big draft. We'll use time slots. And you can ONLY draft during your time slot.
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Post by rockindock on Sept 23, 2015 12:07:02 GMT -5
I have a few more comments but my main concern is the buy in. I don't think it's high enough to persuade most players to stay the 5 seasons if they are having trouble winning. (We are talking 5 seasons, right?) I would like to see a buy in of a minimum of $10 per season. ($50 plus $25 to the prize fund.) I will post some comments regarding free agents after I think about a little more.
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Post by foulballz on Sept 23, 2015 12:32:27 GMT -5
I'm all for bigger buy ins myself, would just hate to restrict entrance for those who couldn't afford it. I also prefer 4 yrs. I feel like winner is figured out by then. Plus, and I'm probably in minority, but I'd prefer the big draft to be most important, instead of amateur draft and IFA maneuvering. It's like, everyone starting out as even as possible, who can put the best team together right now. I'm not married to it though, either is fine. If the 5 year credit is an issue, do we know if it has to be same team, or just same world. Meaning, do we all get the credit after the first season of next tourney?
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Post by rockindock on Sept 23, 2015 12:52:47 GMT -5
I don't know the answer to your last question. I like the 5 season approach because it does add more strategy in my opinion. Signing that IFA or trading for a high draft pick player that may reach the ML by season 4 or 5 peaks my interest. Especially the trading part.
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Post by rockindock on Sept 23, 2015 13:25:40 GMT -5
Minor Leagues -
I don't think there is one owner who liked the last rules. It was tough to keep track of and probably didn't accomplish enough for the effort.
In place of the current rules I would like to see an incentive based minor league rule. I was thinking along the lines of "For every regular season 100 wins accumulated by your five minor league teams the franchise would receive 2 bonus wins toward the tournament standings." Easy to keep track of and may help in keeping minor leaguers alive.
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Post by Mike T on Sept 23, 2015 18:07:46 GMT -5
Per rockindock's request:
1. Less is better. The fewer rules you have, the less likely you are to have someone break them. I'd open up contracts more. Maybe just put a cap on future seasons for when the tourney is over(reason coming).
2. If you're married to all 32 owners participating, get divorced. Keeping 32 owners involved is impossible. We've done the TWC with 5 and now 8. Due to the nature of your game, you need more but you don't need 32. And, if someone drops out, you don't have to beg someone to take a team. You just wait til someone does. That's why I'd open up contracts. You want to be on as level as a playing field as possible with non-competitors.
3. Fewer seasons is better. Once someone is eliminated, it's hard to keep them interested.
4. Barring fewer seasons, you need to incentivize staying despite being out of it. I'm not sure $25 does it since seasons cost $20. Maybe weight the seasons so the last season means more than the first. That would give more owners a chance to make-up the deficit.
5. Whatever the final rules are, making breaking them the death penalty. You're disqualified.
6. If you plan on future versions, require owners to keep their teams. That will do two things: A)encourage them to develop players B) not give out shit contracts.
I'm sure I'll think of more but that's it for now.
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Post by foulballz on Sept 23, 2015 18:38:19 GMT -5
I don't like the idea of rewarding wins for minor leagues. It's the same as taking wins away in this version. Either way you reward the owners who may have more time or are more attentive. It'll create incentive to stock your minors with pros on ST invites or otherwise. The owners who'll benefit from the bonus are likely the same as those who'd nurture their prospects it's the first place. Personally, it would cause me to spend more time on this world checking something that is unenjoyable, and dropping another team I enjoyed due to time constraints. If there needs to be minor league rules, I still stand by my stance, as before this tourney, that a roster minimum is the best way. Owners who nurture their prospects are going to regardless of the rules. Owners that neglect will continue to also. At least roster minimum (25-30 whatever) puts everyone on an equal basis budget wise and prevents someone running out a 3 man squad to save a mil. Heck, just like giving a player option and NTC, someone may think it strategically advantageous to forgo the possible minor league win bonus to save a mil on their BL budget.
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Post by kahrtmen on Sept 23, 2015 18:51:34 GMT -5
I agree that shorter is better. I like 4 years, but I would even do three. The draft was the best part IMO. I also like having money go back to whoever finishes out the tournament for each team.
Will everyone be available in the next draft, free agents included?
Regarding not having 32 players, I am not sure how that will work. The teams not in the tourney could sell talent to the teams in the tourney. They will also have no restrictions on contracts, so they will sign all of the good free agents.
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Post by foulballz on Sept 23, 2015 19:08:27 GMT -5
Drafting free agents would be ideal, but how would that work? Unless we added more rounds and there was no free agency at all. I'm just thinking we need to really simplify. And we need all 32 owners aboard. Guru already said he'd leave. And bastan only has this team. Would he really stay in just to ruin this for everyone else? Don't answer that.
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Post by bjschumacher on Sept 23, 2015 22:26:36 GMT -5
IMO you are all focusing on the wrong part of all of this. If you remember, this tourney started with a Big Bang draft. McHale put together a nice master list spreadsheet for us to work off of. After the draft was over, he figured out who needs to trade this player to whom, etc. It all went pretty smoothly, considering. How are we going to do the Big Bang draft this time? Is someone going to put together a master list? Will someone then figure out who trades who to whom? If we can get that all worked out, then I'm ok if we go with just the stock public world rules from there.
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Post by foulballz on Sept 23, 2015 22:43:25 GMT -5
People are responsible for trading for the players they drafted, I covered this in my first post. Individual owners would be responsible for making sure they aren't sending out the same player in multiple trades. Compiling the list of available players should be easy enough. One copies all the players in the player search page and export it to excel. I'm sure it takes less than half an hour.
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Post by shobob on Sept 24, 2015 5:47:47 GMT -5
I approve of this proposal, but drafting free agents is an issue. There is no way to draft free agents without messing up the free agency once the world starts. I would also add that there should be no re-signing of coaches during the coach rehire period, considering that they are the first tiebreaker for max deals.
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Post by Mike T on Sept 24, 2015 7:32:04 GMT -5
Karhtmen, you're competing against one another not those not involved. If you had 20, you're competing against the other 19. The playing field is even as the other 12 will not be subject to your rules. Additionally, I suggested making contract rules more expansive.
The only caveat with not including everyone would be that the DTW players have the same number of teams in each league at the beginning. With 20, a 12-8 split would create an uneven playing field.
Anyway, dreaming of 32 on board is simply a dream. And you have the same problem again of people dropping out and wondering how you'll fill. Eliminate that problem.
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Post by rockindock on Sept 24, 2015 8:13:42 GMT -5
MINOR LEAGUES -
I'm not a fan of minimum roster sizes. If someone can effectively develop/preserve players using only 20 on the roster that's fine with me. Saving the money to be used elsewhere, why not?
If it's true that under any circumstances there will always be owners that do not care about the minors, then it really doesn't matter how many are on the rooster.
I believe an incentive system would at least reward those that do care about developing players. I would rather have no rules then be told how many players I must use.
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Post by rockindock on Sept 24, 2015 10:10:23 GMT -5
AMATEUR DRAFT -
I concur with your proposed draft rule fb, with one change. I believe there should be a time limit on signing the players selected. Say 10 HBD days or maybe less. As soon as your team signs all the WSFSM players you can then transfer money out of the prospect fund.
The problem with this approach is that each owner must ensure he/she budgets enough money in the prospect fund to sign all the WSFSM players. If an owner cannot sign a player within the established time frame = Death Penalty
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Post by foulballz on Sept 24, 2015 20:56:39 GMT -5
I should point out, I'm not a fan of roster minimums myself. It just seems like the best option to me if we need a rule regarding minors. I just don't like rewards/penalties of wins regarding minors. That doesn't tell the tale of who built the best ML roster. I love the no rules policy best, but realize someone may have an empty roster in the minors and gain the budget advantage. I'm just looking for loopholes. If roster minimums was a rule, at least we're all on the same playing field, no one can gain budget advantage. Sure, some people can develop prospects with a short roster, but we're all even on it though. Personally, I feel I have an advantage budgeting 0 for draft and transferring prospect money to payroll. Current installment hindered my advantage, but we were all on the same playing field. Same can be said for those that like to short Training or Medical. Current rules put a minimum on those. Someone could totally think thats bullshit, my advantage is 0 training. I think its best to not allow a potential budget advantage in any implementation of rules.
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Post by foulballz on Sept 24, 2015 20:58:48 GMT -5
My proposal for not transferring draft budget was also to keep everyone on the same playing field. Not give the guy drafting 32nd more money than the guy drafting 1st. The $6 mil is spent.
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Post by foulballz on Sept 24, 2015 21:13:53 GMT -5
Lets get everyone's thoughts in. I'd like to condense them and present to World Chat for more opinion.
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Post by Mike T on Sept 25, 2015 17:28:40 GMT -5
Not to steal fb's thunder but here's my 30 minute plan. There are really only two rules and both result in automatic disqualification and expulsion.
1. Three season tournament.
2. All Big League wins count. Including playoffs.
3. The only contract restriction is payroll CANNOT exceed 90m for any season AFTER the current tourney ends. It does not matter if all are team options. Any excess is a rules infraction.
4. You MUST begin the season with a minimum of 10 position players, 15 pitchers at AAA/AA/LoA/HiA. As long as your games sim, fatigue/injury does not matter. If they do not, you have committed a rules infraction.
5. You MUST sign all “slot money” draftees and you MUST fill out your rookie league team with tryout/international players after all draftees have been signed(30 players).
6. Any rules infraction results in disqualification and immediate removal.
7. Any owner who chooses to return for the next DTW will keep his team.
8. The draft will be 26 rounds.
9. No participating team can have more than 27 players drafted from his team.
10. The draft will proceed during a designated time period in 30 minute draft windows. If you miss your allotted time, you may pick immediately upon your arrival. You may use a proxy to pick for you. You must notify commissioner if you intend to use a proxy.
11. There will be no draft board but the commissioner will update drafted players, from each team, prior to the next round starting. If this is not done, the draft will be delayed 24 hours.
12. You will be responsible for acquiring your drafted players.
13. Entry fee will be determined at a later date.
14. Prize money will be distributed as follows: 1st-40%, 2nd-25%, 3rd-10%, 4th thru 8th-5%.
15. Non-participating teams will not be subject to any of these rules.
Participating teams may NOT trade with non-participants.
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